Posts tagged soberrecovery

The Daily Crazy

Wendy is a stepper down under, and she has a problem. She recently moved, and she’s dealing with a lot of crazy in her new group. So, she came to the good people at Sober Recovery for some advice. The whole post is a nice summary of a typical AA experience. Below are the last couple of paragraphs, which cover a lot of the lunacy in a short few sentences: You’ve got your 13th stepping, your suicide, your affirmation that she will be in jail were it not for AA, and a crazy AA buddy.

The responses are interesting, too. There is a lot of subtext to them, including Boleo’s implication that those non-fundie, “back-slapping” groups aren’t really AA, and CarolD’s suggestion that God put her in this situation for a reason – with that reason being to start up her own group. Shockingly, nobody has suggested she get away from these nutbags.

Being assertive in AA

And finally, there is a woman here I’ve begun to make friends with, a gay woman who is very strong from the floor, “men are for men and women are for women and the 13th Step” in terms of sponsoship and suppport – and she’s very strident because her last sponsee suicided shortly before I came here, partly due to the 13th Step from a guy . But she’s started to make it clear she likes me “that way”. That wouldn’t worry me so much – I’d just give it to her straight (excuse the pun). But our phone calls are endless diatribue of what her male sponsee is or isn’t doing and it’s truly, in my view, “doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result” – ie, he calls her at 6pm everynight and it’s the same old thing. But SHE TAKES THE CALLS, and at 23 years sober she won’t do the Steps and seek psych help for some genuinely awful stuff that’s happened in her life. So I’ve had to make a major boundary with her, even though she scares me. (She’s done hard prison time – a YET for me)

So, while I know this is just the fabric of AA, we’re all cracked in our own special way, I’d just LOVE a period of quiet when I don’t have to deal with these exhausting dynamics. I work my arse off in AA, with my psychiatrist and psychologist and on my spiritual journey and I refuse to have anyone derail me. But it’s all been a bit of a shock to the system.

Quote of the Day

“…For instance, last week, I shared that in addition to AA, and all of the wonderful people there, that my therapist had also been another very helpful pillar of support. After that, the next five people who shared all went on to have something or other negative to say about therapists and therapy in general, as if I had stepped out of an AA meeting and into a Scientology group. It was bizarre, as I meant no disrespect. It was instructive in how quickly the group reacted to reject the incursion of an idea that they clearly did not want to gain general credence among the members: it was as if an outside force had attacked, and they mobilized against it. It was a very striking example of group dynamics, and, to that extent, a learning experience….”

HuskyPup, an AA. Commenting in the Sober Recovery forum.

Ambiguous Ambiguity


I always get a chuckle at the various forms of mind-bending responses when a newly indoctrinated stepper starts to realize that they are being asked to acquiesce to believing in God, while at that same time being told that AA is not a religious program. I thought the answers to this question over at Sober Recovery were particularly entertaining. Specifically, this post by “RufusACanal” (20 years sober! yea, Rufus!), who scored a full 10 out 10 in passive-aggressiveness:

I struggle some days with God, mostly because I am power hungry. Today, at this moment I do not. I see His results, because I look for His work rather than mine. Keeping it simple, could I have stayed sober these last five plus years via my own will? No. I am a real Alcoholic and there is no human way I could have relieved my malady, I tried for twenty six long and painful years and failed utterly. AA has never been the problem for me, God has never been the problem for me, I have been the problem for me. When I take my petty and insignificant wishes out of the picture, I can see clearly the hand of God and I believe.

If not God then who, you?

Best to you in your journey.

There were a couple of honest responses from Robb B and bugsworth, but the rest of it takes the reader deep into the rabbit hole of AA lunacy.

Sober Recovery Advice of the Day

In response to this statement: [“…Doing the next right thing day in and day out in sobriety and working my butt off to get a job is not supposed to take me from a halfway house (which is a blessing) to a park bench.”]

Enoy sez (in a spiritual, not religious way):

“Million dollar question….

How do you know ?

Who are you to decide how it’s suppose to be ?

In a sincere way , perhaps that is why you haven’t moved on yet. You still have these expectations of how things “should be” based on your own feelings and thoughts rather than “They will be as are”

If you read the 3rd step prayer I think you will see that you haven’t yet completed the third step. I thought I had too until I got a rude awakening to the fact that I had not. ( mentioned this in the other thread )

Many times in my life I’ve gone through terrific struggles , during the struggle I hated it , didn’t understand it , thought it unfair and not right…. Later looking back… It was the best thing that ever happened to me because it gave me new strength, new perspective, new understanding of myself and others.”

You know the “Footsteps in the sand” message right ?

It just. Makes. Sense. Cuz, you know…nothin’ happens by accident. And homelessness is SO much better if God puts you there.

Stinkin’ Thinkin’ Over at the Sober Recovery Forum

What happens when there is dissension in the AA ranks? It depends on the platform. In real life, anyone questioning any part of the program will be derided. On an internet forum run by 12-steppers, they get censored. Even if it is not their AA section.

A few days ago, we were directed to a thread that was started at the Sober Recovery forum titled “The Concept of Powerlessness.” As is most often the case in these discussions about ‘Big Book’ scripture, it devolved into a circle-jerk of pseudo-intellectual mental contortion and philosophizing. I find it difficult to make it through more than three or four posts before my reading voice morphs into the “wah wah wah” of the teacher’s voice in Charlie Brown.

This time, I paid closer attention to the conversation, because a rare voice of trenchancy – “John Barleycorn” – jumped into the conversation. Knowing this was would go over like lead balloon, and knowing the AAs moderating the Sober Recovery forum would delete any challenge to the dogma quicker than one can say “rigorous honesty,” we took a screen shot. Click on the image below to enlarge:

It was followed up with this, which has yet to be deleted, but I’ll go ahead and include it here because I suspect it will be. It’s just makes too much sense:

One problem with using examples from internet forums is, AAs tend to couch their language more than they do one on one or within the confines of a group. What John Barleycorn is asking for is an alternative to tell a person who repeatedly fails. Something beyond a slogan. The answer, of course, is that the program cannot fail. It can only be failed. The onus, and the fault, is always on the individual. Always. It says it right there… in the ‘Big Book’.

It’s almost unfair to ask this of a group that is currently under the AA spell. They’ve been conditioned, and have no point of reference other than the insular world of AA. To a worm in a horseradish, the world is a horseradish.

UPDATE:

Jonny Quest, aka “John Barleycorn,” advised us SR deleted another post that would dare to criticize AA. Here it is:

Quote of the Day

“I have not used the term “dry drunk” since I left AA and one of my (former) AA comrades accosted me in the grocery store and accused me of being one. Right there in the produce section! To her, my actual state of mind and health was unimportant: the only thing that mattered was that I had left the program, and to her, that equated with drinking. Since I was physically sober, that had to mean I was a “dry drunk”.

The term COULD be useful if it was uniformly used to describe a person who is not drinking, but is still exhibiting some of the behaviors of someone who is actively addicted to alcohol. However, as long as it continues to be used as a pejorative term, applied by AA members to outsiders, it is of dubious utility.”

– “onlythetruth“; a former AA in a thread about the term “dry drunk,” sharing his/her experience with a current member of the fellowship after leaving AA.

AA Memories for Lindsay L

OK, kids. It’s time to step into our wayback machines and head to December of ’06, when a fresh-faced Lindsay Lohan first started her serenity journey. Here is an AP article from that time:

NEW YORK — Lindsay Lohan says she’s been going to Alcoholics Anonymous meetings for a year, but hasn’t talked about it because “it’s no one’s business.”

“I just left an AA meeting,” the 20-year-old actress tells People magazine in a story posted Tuesday on its Web site.

“I haven’t had a drink in seven days. Or anything,” she says. “I’m not even legal to, so why would I? I don’t drink when I go to clubs. I drink with my friends at home, but there’s no need to. I feel better not drinking. It’s more fun. I have Red Bull.”

“I’ve been going to AA for a year by the way,” Lohan adds. When asked why didn’t she say so until recently, she replies: “Well it’s no one’s business. That’s why it’s anonymous!”

Lohan says she’s been going to AA for a year

I’m not big on celebrity gossip. Could anyone here update me on what’s happened in Lindsay’s life since then?

Quote of the Day

“One of my favorite Bill Wilson stories (according to biographer Susan Cheever.)

On his death bed, Wilson threatened his attendants to give him a shots of whiskey.

The lessons: Even 36 years of AA won’t knock the alcoholism out of me. Alcoholism will never leave me . I have but a daily reprieve based on my spiritual condition.”

tomvlll, an AA.

Quote of the Day

“And that is a shame that some would spend their time in futile resentment trying to mislabel AA as some religious cult. I have seen some others ex-AA’ers with the same vendetta trying to sway others with their copy and paste twisting meanings. Most of them anti-God Christian hating atheists authors trying to mock AA’ers as brainwashed people when that is the farthest from the truth….”

Nite Byrd, an AA, commenting on this post made about the term “Dry Drunk.”

(I posted the link to a frozen page because I have no doubt the original thread and the link to our site might soon be deleted.)

Fun With Delusion

There is a thread in the works from the fun bunch over the Sober Recovery forum titled, “Why do some alcoholics continue to suffer?” It’s so far out, over-the-top, ’round the bend crazy; and the first two posts are so entertaining, I decided to post a link to it now, so you folks could enjoy the show. Get your popcorn….

Why do some alcoholics continue to suffer?