Posts tagged dogma

He Ain’t No Ward Cleaver

Dana Kessel is a real piece of work. Last month, he got liquored up and slammed into a utility pole, projecting his unrestrained two-year old son into the front windshield:

Dad In Crash Freed on Booze Monitor

Kessel and two of his three children, ages 2 and 4, had gone with a friend, Todd Titus, to the Bowl-O-Mat on River Street, where Kessel told police he had two Coors Light beers and a shot of Southern Comfort liqueur.

Kessel was driving on McPherson Drive when he ran off the road and into a utility pole, police say. A partial Breathalyzer exam later showed a result of .21, more than 21/2 times the legal limit.

Police said that Kessel appeared indifferent to the cries of his bleeding son, who was not secured in his car seat and who was thrown into the dashboard during the crash. The other child was with Titus.

“Yes, the facts are difficult,” defense lawyer Robert Weiner acknowledged.

Now he is out of jail, thanks in part to the help of his AA sponsor, who was there in court to support his new recruit (although I doubt it is his first go at AA, considering this is his third DUI offense). Anyone who allows this to happen to their own child, and then shows complete indifference, is a sociopathic asshole, so he will likely thrive in AA. Unfortunately, it won’t do anything to help him with his drinking problem. This is an example of the harm AA does, and is an answer to the AAs who drive-by our blog and ask why we won’t leave AA alone.

AA Plays Doctor [UPDATED]

It’s so interesting how Alcoholics Anonymous members will deny that what happens in AA actually happens there. They know it happens, and they participate in it, either actively or passively (equally bad). They know we know it happens: the mindfucking, gaslighting, isolating, demoralizing, abusive tough loving, passive aggression, and playing doctor.

Within their creepy little bubbles, this stuff is all normal, and I’m sure it sounds reasonable to them in The Rooms. Our “Comments of the Day” show how unselfconscious they are about being freakin’ nuts with each other when they think no one’s looking. And they do know what it looks like to the reality based community, because when it’s exposed, they don’t own it or say, “Damn right, we do that.”

They deny it. They scoff and bluster. They blame the victims. They minimize it.

After reading Sarah’s, Mona Lisa’s and violet’s experiences in the comments, I would really like to know what people’s experience has been: Have you been told to go off your meds? Told not to get any mental health help outside of AA? That the steps are all you really need? That if you’re on depression medication that you’re not really sober? Did you witness this happen to someone else?

[Please, AAs, please resist the temptation to mansplain the official policy to us. We know what it is. Really.]

UPDATE: Recent Tweet from BigBookRecovery:

Click to Embiggen

(Well, not that recent…)

A little fun with an AA Crazy

Ben found this quote below from Rob B, an AA fundy and reader of our blog, over at “McGowdoghouse”, a blog set up for AAs to vent about this blog, and  how they don’t care about this blog. In my experience with the 12-step fanatics, they are often emotional bullies who only feel comfortable within the insular world of AA, where their lunacy and manipulation of others goes unquestioned. AA is a collecting ground and a carnival for these insecure and sociopathic types, as it gives them unfettered access to those seeking help, who happen to be in an emotionally fragile state. Gaslighting, passive aggressiveness, shutdown statements, implications that if they are not working the steps, then they will be drinking, works well on these people seeking help from their addictions. On the occasions where they venture outside of the AA boundaries, where normal rules of discourse apply; and techniques like passive aggressiveness, ad hominem attacks and shut down slogans don’t work – they are at a loss, and respond like an angry child on a playground. They cannot understand that the dogma and manipulation tactics that they thrive on in AA, do not work for those of us not under the spell.

Reasoning with them or discussing their crazy belief system rationally does not work, because they are so brainwashed and jaded by the AA religion, that they cannot see how far-out crazy they have become. It’s like reasoning with a person who has schizophrenia, and trying to convince them the voices they hear in their head is not real. It’s a pointless exercise in futility. Sometimes I find myself feeling sorry for them. Then I realize what they are doing to people, and that feeling quickly goes away.

With that in mind, I thought it would be a good time to mock Rob B, in the best way I know how: by using his own words to make himself look like an ass. I thought it would be fun to include this quote, along with some of the “12 promises” of AA, which I have included in bold brackets:

…I figure they are just bored, or the most bitter vile pseudo intellectual folks I’ve ever seen.

I have been mixing it up with our good friends at ST, shame on me. There is no winning with these people, they don’t play by their own rules and have nothing to offer anyone. I would do well to steer clear of them, they really don’t know what they are talking about.

If MA or SPeedy were on fire, I’d be hard pressed to piss on them. [We will lose interest in selfish things and gain interest in our fellows] now if they wanted to recover from alcoholism, I could and would offer them something.

Funny thing about that site is that some of our biggest critics can’t stay sober, hmmmm, get back to me when you’ve found something.

Patrick [Mcgowdog],

I’m beginning to see where some of your anger and intensity comes from, [We will comprehend a new serenity/We will know peace] to [sic] bad this wasn’t real life, we could go over and kick their ass LOL. [We will intuitively know how to handle situations which used to baffle us] I hope they come over and cut and past this to suit their scripts. If any ST folks are reading this, I am kidding. If MA is reading this, with all the love I can muster go fuck yourself.

Spirituality as a Bait and Switch Technique

CNN posted an article on their site this week titled, “Are there dangers to being ’spiritual but not religious’?” I’m not going to comment on the entire article, as it is the same circle jerk of an examination into this statement that anyone who has been run through the world of AA logic has experienced. There are a couple of parts that made me chuckle, however. Like this:

“It’s a trendy phrase people often use to describe their belief that they don’t need organized religion to live a life of faith.

But for Jesuit priest James Martin, the phrase also hints at something else: egotism.

“Being spiritual but not religious can lead to complacency and self-centeredness,” says Martin, an editor at America, a national Catholic magazine based in New York City. “If it’s just you and God in your room, and a religious community makes no demands on you, why help the poor?”

I would love to see this priest speak out at an AA meeting. Their fucking heads would explode!

Then there is this quote from BJ Gallagher. Huffington Post contributor, and 12-step apologist extraordinaire:

“Twelve-step people have a brilliant spiritual community that avoids all the pitfalls of organized religion,” says Gallagher, author of “The Best Way Out is Always Through.”

“Each recovering addict has a ‘god of our own understanding,’ and there are no priests or intermediaries between you and your god. It’s a spiritual community that works.”

This is absolute garbage. The idea that the ’Big Book’ advocates a “god of our understanding” is as laughable as the idea that there are no intermediaries between an AA and his/her god. The AA god™ is specific, and is not a “god of our understanding”, but is “God as we understand Him”. The ‘Big Book’ is specific on this point, just as it is clear in the ‘We Agnostics’ chapter that any other god one chooses is simply a proxy to be used until the person reaches spiritual enlightenment, and comes to believe in the AA god™.

Of course, there will be people who continue to say that they are using pez dispensers or bridges as their god, but even the most deluded and brainwashed AA intuitively knows inanimate objects cannot restore sanity, remove shortcomings and answer prayers. That is almost as absurd as the belief that there is a god hovering over you, waiting for you to work those steps so He can relieve you of your drinking addiction. Still, when AAs pray their god, they are praying to a specific one who spends His time in the rooms, helping alcoholics with their problems, to the exclusion of the starving kids, genocide, homelessness, et al. – which are the domain of the regular church gods. AA god™ does one thing, and doesn’t do it particularly well. He intervenes in the lives of alcoholics.

Australian for “Bullshit”

A couple of weeks ago we posted about ‘public education seminar’ that a group of Australian AAs are throwing together. It looks like they are going beyond this, and are putting together a full blown ad campaign. Of course, there is no law that prevents any organization from advertising its services – even a religious one like AA – but for an organization who claims to be one of ‘attraction, not promotion’, it is just another example of how they are full of shit. Is there anything this group does not lie about? One thing I noticed they did not mention in these ads was their Chairman’s admission of their 95% dropout rate (yeah, it seems AA Australia’s success rate is the same goose egg that it is in North America).

Quote of the Day

First off, if you don’t do the steps of course you go back out. Heck, if you don’t get a sponsor, and won’t do 90 in 90, and won’t do the steps, you were never in! How can you go back out? How can you relapse if you never attain?

When I was taken through the steps I was told that AA required constant and unending spiritual growth until I died. I was told that the character building never ends, and that I was responsible when a suffering alcoholic put out his hand for help. But much more than what I was told, it was what I was shown. My sponsor and his circle of friends were all in their late 60s, and they were 12 stepping machines. You could ask them any day what they were building in their character, and they could and did come right back with the answer of what they were working on.

My sponsor once drove through a hurricane to do a 12th step. Believe me, he wasn’t crazy, just willing. The person he went to told me that he arrived moments before the suicide. On the night he died my sponsor went out on a 12th step at 9pm, and died at 2pm. I might add that he died in his sleep, sober, serene, and loved by very many.

My sponsor was always taking people through the steps. When ever he made an assignment of any kind for a sponsee he went and did it again himself. He said he had seen too many old timers falling into telling people to do things they had long since stopped doing. This approach to serving and character building kept him constantly recycling the steps, and it caused him to apply AA principles in all his affairs.

To the best of my knowledge, all the people he sponsored are still sober. It is my intention to keep doing the actions he took, that kept him sober, and that gave him such a clean and serene end.

From a response posted yesterday on a year-old thread over at Friends of Bill called “relapse is ‘stinkin’-thinkin'”.

The original post is some bonus crazy:

We are speaking of those who are capable of being honest with themselves. Relapse is caused by a lack of spiritual development and we believe in a spiritual solution that recovery is completely and directly dependent on the integrity of the individuals spiritual program. It is not based on support groups from finite man, ((b) That probably no human power could have relieved our alcoholism..) but upon the individuals spiritual fitness- how well one “trust God, and cleans house”.

Thinking in Circles

When last we left off, we were taking an exam to determine whether or not we are real alcoholics. Among the things learned were, if a person can stop drinking on their own for a certain period of time, they are not an alcoholic:

This person….can also stop or moderate, although they may find it difficult and troublesome and may even need medical attention. Have you found a sufficient reason to quit and has that reason kept you sober or clean? *Note: If you can answer “YES” to this question, you are NOT an alcoholic or addict!

This brings us to Dave C., an AA and participant over at the Friends of Bill forum. Dave, who has been diligently working the steps, but has yet to have his own white light experience, asks:

“I have been wondering this for some time. I had a spiritual awakening, followed by a relapse 2 months later, followed by a 14 year dry drunk, got heavily involved in meetings and the steps and quiet times and can honestly say I havent [sic] felt my makers presence, but have had plenty of improved periods of perspective I’d call it, but no contact with H.P. Has anyone here had a long period of dry drunk after a relapse and had another spiritual awakening? I’d love to hear about it. I could use some advice in this.”

The most obvious piece of advice to me would be for him to take some belladonna. The second bit of advice should have been that he is not really an alcoholic, since he was able to quit on his own for fourteen years. Of course, that is not how it really works. In AA, if you can quit on your own for any period of time, you were never really an alcoholic. Unless, of course, if you come back to AA, in which case you were a ‘dry drunk’. Does this make sense? Of course it doesn’t. It is just another piece of circular logic one is subjected to when entering the rooms of AA.

You Never Win

LUNATICS ANONYMOUS: I have been sober for two years today. You’re not sober, you’re just abstinent. OK, I’m just abstinent, not sober and I haven’t had a drink for two years. You might be abstinent but, you’re not sober. You’re just a dry drunk. OK, I’m just a sober dry drunk. No, you’re not sober. OK, I’m just an abstinent dry drunk. You might be dry but, you don’t have sobriety. I thought I was sober. You might be sober but, you don’t have good sobriety. Is there a difference? Yes, there is. There is abstinent sobriety but, you have bad sobriety. What, I have bad sobriety? Yes, because you are not in recovery. I thought I was in recovery whereas I haven’t had a drink in two years. You’re not in recovery, you are only around recovery. You never recover. I thought that because I’m in recovery that I was sober. No, you never recover, you’re just abstinent. But, I attend A.A. every day. That doesn’t matter because, you are only around A.A., and you’re not in A.A. But, I’m in the program. Yes, you’re in the program but, you’re not working a good program. OK, I’m only around A.A., working a bad program and not sober. But, I am working the 12 steps. No, you only think you are working the steps. I thought if I was abstinent and attending A.A. that I was in recovery. No, that’s your problem, you only thought you were sober. I thought that I had good sobriety as I was attending A.A. That’s another problem you have. You’re thinking, when you were told to sit down, take the cotton out of your ears and put it in your mouth. But, I can’t talk with the cotton in my mouth. That’s good, because you don’t know what you are talking about, just sit there for 90 days and don’t talk or think. But, I think I am sober. No, you’re just not drinking, you don’t have quality sobriety. What, there is good sobriety and bad sobriety and now quality sobriety? Yes there is and you don’t have either or. You’re just a dry drunk. How can I be drunk if I’m sober? I told you that you’re not sober, you’re just not drinking. OK. F**K this bullshit, I think I’ll go the bar and have a few drinks.

Re-posted with permission from Lunatics Anonymous


EZ just gave us a link to a good  article about SMART Recovery. Thanks, EZ!

Quote of the Day

“My Higher Power today is not a God in the Judeo/Christian sense but more of an amalgamation of belief systems. There is a little Buddhism in Her, a bit of the Native American Great Spirit and a lot of my son in Her.  Sometimes I call Her HP…sometimes Great Spirit and sometimes just ‘Dave’.”

Kim Manlove, treatment center volunteer and AA advocate