Sexual Device Assault

Carolee Bildsten is an AA in Illinois who pulled the “dine and dash” routine at a Joe’s Crab Shack. I supposed she figured that since she has given crabs to so many others, it is about time for someone to reciprocate. When the police found her down the street, and took her to her apartment to get some cash to pay her tab, she attacked a cop with – I shit you not – a vibrator:

Police say Bildsten is charged with theft and aggravated assault for walking out on a restaurant tab Nov. 9, then using the plastic sex toy to attack an officer who was trying to collect the money.

I swear, you can’t make this stuff up.

Bond revoked again in assault case

Sex Toy Assault: Woman Attack Cop With ‘Pleasure Device’

  • Gunthar2000

    These are the people we're supposed to turn our will and lives over to?

  • causeandeffect

    LOL! Wouldn't that be called higher battery power?

  • causeandeffect

    It gives a whole new meaning to "copping a buzz."

  • eddy

    next thing you know they crazy AAers will be telling her the only way to keep sober is to sponsor another, remember ol Bill Wilson could only keep himself sober by trying to get the rest of the drinkers to join the oxford group.

  • eddy

    I love the defense attorney's relapse is part of the disease , who is to say she relapsed, could it be she never stopped drinking to relapse.

  • How is her sponsor going to help with step 8?

    "8. Made a list of all persons we had harmed, and became willing to make amends to them all."

    Of course Step 9 is going to be even more fun –

    "9. Made direct amends to such people wherever possible, except when to do so would injure them or others. "

  • causeandeffect

    It gives a whole new meaning to "assault and battery."

  • Gunthar2000

    "We will love you until you can learn to love yourself!" cried Carolee as she lunged across the room with a buzzing vibrator in hand.

  • Tony J

    Gunter Glieben Glochan Globen :

    These are the people we’re supposed to turn our will and lives over to?

    More critical thinking from Gunter ?

    'God as we understood him' would be the AA suggestion.

    You may do as you wish Gunter, since you're a high thinker.

  • Gunthar2000

    G.O.D.

    Group of drunks… Ever heard of that one Tony J?

  • Words of wisdom from AA – Can you follow them Tony J?

    "Why are you so angry?

    "What you need is a meeting"

    "Get off your pity pot"

    "Taking others inventory (when you should be taking your own)."

    "H.O.W.=Honesty, Open-mindedness, Willingness."

    "A.A. has a wrench to fit every nut that walks through the door."

    "People who are wrapped up in themselves make a very small package indeed…"

    "Insanity is defined as doing the same thing over, and over again, expecting different results."

    "Dont' work my program, or your program, work THE program."

    "If you hang around the barber shop long enough, you'll get a haircut."

    "Short version of the Serenity Prayer: Lighten up."

    "If you fly with crows, you get shot at."

    "The mind is like a parachute, it works better when it's open"

    "I didn't get sober to be miserable."

    Don't even bother to reply…………….. you have already answered……..

  • Gunthar2000

    I honestly feel sorry for the poor bastards who are still stuck in AA's mind trap… It was a painful way to live… believing that everything was my fault… crucifying myself on a daily basis… never allowed to believe I was worthy… I am so grateful to people like Terry (orange) and Jack Trimpey who had the gut's to step forward and call AA what it is.

  • SoberPJ

    When she makes an amends to the cop, she'll be looking at her shoes and humbly mumbling, " I'm sorry,… I'm sorry, I attacked you with… my … vibrator. " It will be an AA classic amends moment.

  • Gunthar2000

    All you have to do is stop drinking too much alcohol. It's not about character defects, spirituality, diseases, or making amends… It's about resisting the temptation to overindulge.

    I've found that the easiest way for me to do this is to avoid alcohol entirely.

    I wonder if this poor woman was not trapped in the same confusion. I wonder if she had just given up.

    AA is obviously not the answer to her problems.

  • OK enough Troll talk – lets get back to the real question:

    What happens when this AA member gets out of jail and claims she has enough sobriety to have sponcee's since she has no training? AA has no checks in place to prevent her from being a sponsor. How can we ware people about these dangers?

  • Gunthar2000

    Let's consider that Carolee Bildsten might not be some inherently evil AA member who will some day prey on others. From what I can see here, this woman hasn't hurt anyone but herself. She's been through the AA ringer, and I'll bet it hasn't helped her a bit with her drinking problem.

    Sure the vibrator thing is funny, but there is tragedy in this story as well.

    Carolee, if you ever read this, please take the time to read some of the other posts in this blog. You may be surprised to find that you've experienced some of the let downs that many of us have, and hopefully you'll be inspired to seek another method to deal with your problem.

  • causeandeffect

    It gives a whole new meaning to the term "blunt force trauma."

    Seriously though, it's very sad….

    LOL HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!

    Thanks MA, I really needed that today!

  • AnnaZed

    Yeah, after the initial titter I felt a sort of wave of rage over this thing. Risking being a bitchy female I would say that Carolee's photograph would indicate that the whole "relapse is part of recovery" thing has been in full bloom in her life for some time with quite possibly a smattering of methamphetamine in the mix (though that is not mentioned, so maybe she is just a drunk).

    The article itself is actually about her bond being revoked. Now, really that is not news and happens every day. It is the drunken vibrator incident that makes this news, and I dare say that will follow her for the rest of her life. She probably doesn't care now, but someday she might.

    There is a vehicular matter here (a DUI) so I'm all for the seizing of her Camry, and really it's just too bad if she says that she can't get to work or Church or her AA meetings without it, but I wonder at what point she herself, her family or the constabulary might reasonably conclude that AA just isn't working for her.

    I too think that there just might be more to this story then has been dreamt of in AA's philosophy. We read article after article about people being charged with far more grievous insults to public harmony than these and walking away free into the arms of AA. What makes Carolee so special? Notice the mention of the "hotel" where Ms. Bildsten is said to reside. That says welfare hotel and extreme poverty to me, maybe prostitute (though again she isn't charged with that). I sort of doubt that she has any support system, any family in her life to help her. You have the drunken incidents in September, November and again in December (it looks like twice) so again it is reasonable to infer that AA just isn't helping all that much, though her lawyer says that she has amped up her AA participation to 5 nights a week. I'm going to have to side with Gunthar and fervently hope that she finds her way here.

  • causeandeffect

    “Uh, are those copper top batteries you’re using?”

  • eddy

    do you think her higher power was her vibrator?

  • It could have been. In AA you are supposed to be able to pick any higher power you want…. until your sponsor, who has no training in psychology or anything except a few years sobriety after their jail term says so!

  • hulahoop

    @mike Well, when she’s at the podium she can phallus in on all the details.

    Fuck oh dear, I am so sick. That is too funny.

  • I do believe that there is more to the vibrator story than we are being told. The press loves to blow this stuff out of proportion. You can be charged with assaulting a police officer if you even touch them by accident. I mean the officer could have just used that as an excuse to make a point.

  • causeandeffect

    c&e said

    “It gives a whole new meaning to “copping a buzz.”
    Or should it be buzzing a cop?
    I’m my own heckler

  • DeConstructor

    @Tony J

    "It says the group will act as a bridge until you find the ‘God of your understanding’ ."

    As much as the AA faith likes to dance around that, poorly, that statement alone states that CONVERSION is REQUIRED for those of us who are proudly atheists.

    Some of us do believe that ALL religion is a bad thing, including steppism. I personally feel that religion causes people to steal planes and ram them into buildings.

  • eddy

    I agree with you gunthar , she probably has been through the ringer at AA and her self esteem which is probably critically low is not benefiting from the cult of powerlessness.
    We don’t know if hunger and lack of cash was the reason for the dine and dash, but overall the story centers around the cop being attacked with a vibrator which is why the press picked up on it and makes the story amusing.

  • I agree with Tony J –

    We should all read the 164 pages of the Big Book. Bill W claims to have written the Big Book, he even left part of the royalties that he gets from it to his mistress. I'm sure if he were still around he would jump right on the chance to be her sponsor and help her out. Given that he liked to openly cheat on his wife, I wonder what his motivation was? I'm sure he didn't write the Big Book as a road map to 13th Step women in need of help. Did Bill W meet his mistress in the rooms of AA? How many vulnerable women did he have follow the 12 Steps so he could take advantage of them?

    Bill W was a very smart man, he left a legacy behind that millions of people are using to follow in his foot steps. I just hope they all don't have the same "Moral Defects" that he had. Sorry just using "Rigorous Honesty" in this post.

  • Mike

    Decon: [ Some of us do believe that ALL religion is a bad thing, including steppism. I personally feel that religion causes people to steal planes and ram them into buildings.]

    I'm not necessarily of that mindset. Suicide bombers and the like can arise for a multitude of reasons – social, political, as well as religious.

    I think religion has a role to play in society because it provides ritual and a sense of continuity in the face of what can be a chaotic and unpredictable world. This is in fact what attracted me to AA early on. It was a place where I could find predictable ritual and a sense of community while I abstained from alcohol. I would in fact return if I could find a group that was devoid of (1) back-to-basic types (2) flagrantly neurotic people and (3) parolees and ex-cons. Find me a meeting nowadays that excludes such types and I'll likely attend.

    And TonyJ(d), please don't play the elitist "you think you're better than us" card. I've heard it all before. I'm at the point in my life where I don't have to feel bad about staying away from people I find distasteful.

  • tintop

    Tonyj, I will love you until you can love yourself; remember, the truth will set you free,but first it will piss you off.

    We really want to help you tony, so please continue to be rigorously honest. You will be a better man for it. Progess before perfection.

    Have a great day. keep coming back!!

  • This story reminded me of another recent story, which I’m not going to link to.

    This woman was staying in a motel with her kids, and went out to her van for a little (ahem) privacy. She’s in her van masturbating with a toy when the cops show up and find a loaded gun in the vehicle, so they arrest her. Her mugshot gets plastered all over the internet, with a headline that’s so sensationalistic that I thought she was firing her gun out the window while she was indulging herself. But no. She was from Texas, traveling with her kids, and had a gun in her van. She had crossed state lines and didn’t know that she was breaking the gun laws. She wasn’t drunk or high or negligent — just having a little grownup time.

    I can’t even imagine the humiliation this woman and her kids suffered for a bunch of headline click-throughs.

    Definitely, I agree with Gunthar, too. Carolee Bildsten is another casualty of a broken addiction treatment industry.

  • hulahoop

    You can use the AA group as a higher power since they are a group of people who have solved their alcohol problem.

    It never says they are to run your life. It says the group will act as a bridge until you find the ‘God of your understanding’ .

    Use the group as a higher power? Bullshit. Cult speak.

    Despite AA’s faults, this woman would not be publicly mocked at an AA meeting like she has been here.

    You are so right! They wouldn't do it in front of her but they would whisper and snicker about her behind her back. Some of the men would probably try to 13th step her because she must be easy if she owns a vibrator.

  • Tony J

    C+E

    "Tony, you can pretend to be superior all you want, but you’re not fooling anyone who has seen the other blog you post on."

    "I only went there because I really didn’t believe you and your friend could be so vile and disgusting, but you are. Far, far, far worse than anything you could ever find here. "

    I'm more just pointing out that you're a hypocrite rather than saying I'm superior to you. I don't really bother to gauge myself morally against immoral people. It's pointless.

    As far as being worse than anything posted here, I think you are so self righteous and deluded that your not capable of making that judgement.

    This post alone is far, far, far worse than anything we've ever put out on that blog.

    You mock the people like this lady every day. We mock you for doing it. Being amoral you don't know why there's a difference, but there is.

    Sticking up for people who can't defend themselves is a virtue in theistic circles. Atheists, of course see the weak as tools to use for their own pleasure.

    But technically you're probably right. Anyone who acts the way you do towards people with real problems must be just as beat down inside as they are.

    So I should probably cut you a break. But I'm not going to because what you do here is still wrong.

    That's enough grown up talk from me. Go watch tv with Gunter and Mike.

    MA

    "Actually, it doesn’t say that, Tony. The book is specific. It says, “God as you understand Him.” The AA God is specific."

    Actually it does. Ask one of your Harvard friends for a copy and read it and and then we'll talk.

    In the mean time keep preaching to your cult. They're too lazy to read and will believe what you tell them.

    Soon you too can have as many women as you imagine Bill W had…….won't that be great MA ?

    HH :

    "You are so right! They wouldn’t do it in front of her but they would whisper and snicker about her behind her back. ".

    Obviously, people like you and AnnaZ who post on this site would have done just that.

    Not EVERYONE would. There are plenty of people in AA who know who they are and where they came from.

    The problem with being a low minded gossip is you tend to think everyone else is a gossip too.

    It makes you paranoid.

  • Mfc66

    Was the device powered by AA batteries?

  • "you’re a hypocrite"

    "immoral people"

    "you are so self righteous and deluded"

    "Being amoral you…"

    "Atheists…" (not that this is a bad thing, but TJ thinks it is)

    "too lazy to read and will believe what you tell them."

    "low minded gossip"

    @Ben, Nope. Obviously, I can't explain why that post is not full of ad hominems… That's all it is. It blows my mind how Tony insists to the world that we censor the truth here or asserts that we banned him for being to smart for us when this shit-talk is all he ever brings to the table. I don't believe he understands the difference between debating, as in "This post is disgusting, in poor taste, stupid, whatever, and here's why…" or "I disagree with you based on bla bla bla" and an ad hominem: "You are amoral, therefore you're wrong." And he thinks he's the adult around here.

    I guess the Tony J Experiment will be short lived, and he can go back to telling the world that we censor the truth (as opposed to all the 12-Step websites that allow a lively and unfettered flow of ideas).

  • Mike

    Most atheists I know hate people who claim to speak on behalf of an ephemeral deity

  • hulahoop

    @ causeandeffect It gives a whole new meaning to “copping a buzz.”
    Or should it be buzzing a cop?
    I’m my own heckler.

    Too fucking funny. Great, warped minds think a like. Really they do.

    My mind is a little in the gutter right now so please forgive me –
    Damn. I could have made a vibrator my higher power? The thought never even crossed my mind even though I’ve heard some people do call out to God when a vibrator is involved. My higher power can be a doorknob, a bed pan, the carpet on the floor, or a vibrator? I am sure a lot more women would get involved in AA if they knew this to be true.

    Okay, mind out of the gutter.
    This lady has been advised by her attorney to go to AA meetings so the judge will view her in more favorable light. That is what lawyers do. They tell you to do things that will make their life easier when they actually are forced to go to court and represent you.

    How in the hell do you explain this type of behavior to anyone? I’ve been drunk a bazillion times but I never dashed and dined and I never attacked anyone with my vibrator. Good Lord. It takes all kinds.

  • Ton J –

    We get back what we give. "When you are good to others, you are best to

    yourself." When you think the other person is dumb, you are making a fool of yourself. The key to happiness is not that you never get upset, frustrated or irritated. It is

    how quickly you decide to snap out of it. Think think think. Forgiveness can be difficult, but to simply release and let go of past hurts is a

    skill that can be learned with practice. Fortune favors the brave. So throw off the bowlines. Sail away from the safe

    harbor. Catch the trade winds in your sails. Explore. Dream. Discover! If you deliberately plan on being less than you are capable of being, then I warn

    you that you'll be unhappy for the rest of your life. Winning isn't getting ahead of others, it is getting ahead of yourself. Build up your weaknesses until they become your strong points.Build up your weaknesses until they become your strong points. Build up your weaknesses until they become your strong points. Try not to judge people.

  • Mike

    Omg! Tj and mcgowdog dedicated some softcore porn to me, too funny

  • Mike

    Well, when she’s at the podium she can phallus in on all the details.

  • Tony J

    "One of the most widely misused terms on the Net is "ad hominem". It is most often introduced into a discussion by certain delicate types, delicate of personality and mind, whenever their opponents resort to a bit of sarcasm. As soon as the suspicion of an insult appears, they summon the angels of ad hominem to smite down their foes, before ascending to argument heaven in a blaze of sanctimonious glory. They may not have much up top, but by God, they don't need it when they've got ad hominem on their side. It's the secret weapon that delivers them from any argument unscathed.

    In reality, ad hominem is unrelated to sarcasm or personal abuse. Argumentum ad hominem is the logical fallacy of attempting to undermine a speaker's argument by attacking the speaker instead of addressing the argument. The mere presence of a personal attack does not indicate ad hominem: the attack must be used for the purpose of undermining the argument, or otherwise the logical fallacy isn't there. It is not a logical fallacy to attack someone; the fallacy comes from assuming that a personal attack is also necessarily an attack on that person's arguments.

    Therefore, if you can't demonstrate that your opponent is trying to counter your argument by attacking you, you can't demonstrate that he is resorting to ad hominem. If your opponent's sarcasm is not an attempt to counter your argument, but merely an attempt to insult you (or amuse the bystanders), then it is not part of an ad hominem argument. "

    http://plover.net/~bonds/adhominem.html

    The actual ad hominem attack was by C+E.

    Rather than respond to my point that this blog is way more unhealthy for a woman like that in the article than an AA meeting she attacked my character.

    My rant used some insulting generalizations but I was just responding to C+E. Since she brought it up I gave her my reasons. I wasn't responding to her argument I was just defending my general position on the matter.

    If you would like I'll just quote straight from the Big Book and your friends can mock me and insult my religious beliefs and my sanity and intelligence.

    I figured they'd enjoy mixing it up a bit since they pop off so much, but I gave them credit for character they don't have.

    Mybad.

    I keep forgetting I'm dealing with females.

  • SoberPJ

    Ok, I think I get it now…this Tony J character is simply just that, somebodies made up character. Nobody today is really like that, right? I mean c'mon "I keep forgetting I'm dealing with females" is simply some jokers way of trying to incite the situation. Very creative, but I don't see any point beyond incitement. No one that expresses themselves that way is ever taken seriously. So, is the intent to not be taken seriously and show AA's as sexist, bigoted, put down artists? If so, that's not very fair to the vast majority of AA's who are not like that at all. Deluded, yes. Sexist, bigoted and just plain mean, no.

  • hulahoop

    PS – anna said titter.

  • Tony J

    Gunter :

    “Group of drunks… Ever heard of that one Tony J?”

    Yes Gunter, I actually have.

    Group of drunks goes back the the We Agnostics chapter.

    You can use the AA group as a higher power since they are a group of people who have solved their alcohol problem.
    It never says they are to run your life. It says the group will act as a bridge until you find the ‘God of your understanding’ .

    In AA (at least according to the BB) God runs your life, not your AA group.

    Honestly, it’s 164 pages and you’ve had years to read it.

    Gunter, you might be better off watching TV. You don’t seem to have a knack for reading.

    FTG :

    “Definitely, I agree with Gunthar, too. Carolee Bildsten is another casualty of a broken addiction treatment industry.”

    Maybe, maybe not. But we do know she’s a victim of your little holier than though community here.

    Making jokes at other’s misfourtunes is pretty much all you anti-AA’s do.
    It’s funny when the critical thinking Gunter tries to reel her in after ridiculing her.

    Despite AA’s faults, this woman would not be publicly mocked at an AA meeting like she has been here.

    Good job.

    And Gunter, good luck winning her over. You’re quite the charmer.

    • MA

      You can use the AA group as a higher power since they are a group of people who have solved their alcohol problem.
      It never says they are to run your life. It says the group will act as a bridge until you find the ‘God of your understanding’ .

      Actually, it doesn't say that, Tony. The book is specific. It says, "God as you understand Him." The AA God is specific. You aren't allowed to pick and choose a god, at least if you are going to go by the 'Big Book.' Now, if you are one of those hippie, new age treatment centre type of AAs – then that's a whole different ballgame. They're the denomination that allows doorknobs and chickens and such to be a higher power. I always thought that you were a fundie, but I may be wrong here.

      The Agnostics chapter simply says that one must be willing to the possibility of this god, who fixates on alcoholics (he really dotes over them), exists; and that they are willing to accept him.

  • Martha

    Tony J like the late Billy W. has the habit of saying things that sound vague, but are in reality meaningless.

  • tintop

    keep coming back tony.!! We all just love ya to pieces!!

    and, have a great day!!

  • mfc66

    @TJ" Despite AA’s faults, this woman would not be publicly mocked at an AA meeting like she has been here."

    What total crap, I remember a story being passed round the rooms in London about a man who had admitted to shagging a goat during an aftercare session which he believed to be confidential and this was made public in AA and loads of people took the piss. He left and relapsed after the humiliation. I have never been anywhere else where there is so much gossip about member's private business than AA. Many members do not lead meaningful lives outside the rooms and obsessed with others and are immature in their approach to life in general.

  • causeandeffect

    Tony, you can pretend to be superior all you want, but you’re not fooling anyone who has seen the other blog you post on. I saw it once when someone from here posted what you and your friend posted over there. I only went there because I really didn’t believe you and your friend could be so vile and disgusting, but you are. Far, far, far worse than anything you could ever find here. And of course she will be mocked in AA. They mock people for as little as not saying they are an alcoholic when they are sent due to a DUI because they assume “normies” never get a DUI.

    I do feel sorry for Carolee. While the story is funny, her situation is very serious. I wish they had at least allowed her the dignity of not including her photo. I just hope she has a very strong sense of humor about herself.

  • hulahoop

    And no, the group has NOT solved their alcohol problem. They might be sober but they think and talk about drinking all of the time. To solve a problem means you address it, do what is necessary to to fix it, learn from it, try not to repeat the circumstances leading to it, and move on. You do not make the problem a life time commitment. You don’t define yourself by it. And you certainly don’t become addicted to meetings and a cult. It is substituting one thing for another. “Yeah, I am sober thanks to the group. I am able to remain to sober because of the group. I need the group to stay sober.” Bullshit.

  • Ben Franklin

    FTG, Please explain why Tony J’s last post is not full of Ad hominems.

  • Tony J

    MA :

    “Now, if you are one of those hippie, new age treatment centre type of AAs – then that’s a whole different ballgame. They’re the denomination that allows doorknobs and chickens and such to be a higher power. I always thought that you were a fundie, but I may be wrong here. ”

    Opps. I used the Step 2 line. My bad.
    I should know better. I’m not sure if the 12/12 is off limits to AA fundies.

    I just tend to take the BB at fact value. It’s self explanitory. I don’t know what that makes me. AA is more of a religion to atheists than it is to theists.

    I used to work with an evangelical Christian. I was naive (because of AA) and he used to tell me on a regular basis that atheists don’t not believe in God, that actively hate Him.
    I thought he was silly until I became aquainted with the anti-AA movement. He was 100% correct. Who would have thunk it ?

    Anyway, doorknobs and chairs are not a higher power to me. But anti-AA blogs aren’t either and they seem to keep alot of people sober. You just can’t tell about these things.

  • AnnaZed

    Ah well, it was fun while it lasted I guess. Some people are just getting too stroppy.

    http://www.thefreedictionary.com/stroppy

  • Stroppy is a fine, fine word!

  • Ben Franklin

    If anyone here misses or needs an uncalled for verbal beatdown from Tony J you can reach him at:

    http://www.stinkin-thinkin-revealed.blogspot.com/

    I see no reason to go there and so does almost everyone.

  • SoberPJ

    In the ecosystem of AA one can easily become a legend in their own mind. There is no certification program. There is no AA Phd. Just folks following a book written by a very sick man with no real authoritative source for any of the material. The opinions on this site can sometimes get one sided, and I’m guilty of that at times. However, I can’t see ANY logic in creating a blog that recommends an R-rated, filth-ridden blog as an alternative to this one. There’s a screw loose.

  • Mona Lisa

    “If you want what we have….”

    Er, thanks, but no.

  • Sorry Mike –

    I had to look at your dedication on the AA porn site you were talking about. It does appear that they are posting pictures to attract people to AA by showing who attends these meetings. The picture of the naked girl in front of all of the drugs does not appear to be 18 or over. I wonder if they realize they can be arrested for that if she is not?

  • AnnaZed

    You know what the great thing about the interwebs is?

    I can make it just like AA if I want to; no cross talk!

    I just post what’s on my mind, read the stuff that interests me and leave the rest. It’s so neat!

  • Gunthar2000

    @Tony J.

    I’m going to do my best to ignore your posts.

  • Johny Crash

    Mr Tony J I see your seeking to agitate and defend the mysticism which is AA Mysticism is an ancient philosophy which went out in the Dark Ages and the Middle ones To believe in a "God" or a "Higher Power" to restore one to sanity is the same as faith healing or back in the olden days they would bleed the patient in a barbers chair … would we consider that a cure today …???

    By definition according to their own literature all AAs are mentally ill (I for one

    find that abusive and stereotypical thats the same as saying they all look alike)

    AA when it started in my opnion was a money making scam a shot for Bill Wilson and Doctor Bob and company to sell snake oil … Bill Wilson might not have ever drank again but it is fact he took LSD to increase his spiritual awareness in the 60s it is a fact he couldnt even quit smoking and eventually died of it … (guess he wasnt entirely ready)

    I can muck rake those two like you wouldnt believe now but I wont because they are dead … I will say neither ever worked an honest day after they got together and leeched of of desperate people … I can only speak from personal history …what I have personally seen in the rooms

    Which I do not have to share with you …

    You say and I quote "I'm sorry I didnt know this site was to be taken seriously"

    Thats such a revealing statement it conveys to me a sense of arrogance and an elitist state of mind a I'm better than you …. which to me is the furthest thing from humility I can see I also sense anger which is a by product of fear …. yeah you know the fear thing … well Tony if your a true believer you should embrace that 3rd step that says nothing happens with Gods input.. you should accept that we are here for a reason and I should accept your here for a reason …. I don't surf AA sites anymore I don't want what they have I don't feel a need to engage in debate over philosophy because thats what AA is its a Philosophy and a religion no I don't need to prove my point I have no self doubt I have made the right decision …. I have stop abusive self destructive behavior on my own I have no fear of the future …

    you can be mean to me Tony its ok you see like they say in the fellowship "I still love you keep coming back" … I respect your right to self to bee free to have an opinion to seek to engage in intelectual and philsophical … Ill never say something like …. Put the cotton in your mouth …or … Don't think …. I want you to think really think really really think about what your moral code in this life will be that whole in the donut they talk about when you just give and give unconditionally … well Bill W died a wealthy man thanks to AA so Did Bob …. it was easy for them to say … but they didn't do … Bill left his Mistress a nice little sum … now who;s in charge of a ten billion dollar a year snake oil sale… Ive been looking for years but no one seems to know where that dollar goes …

    I was one time a true true truest of believers then one day I woke up …..it happened fast once I opened the door I saw the truth …that it was all a lie … it shocked me at first I was angry then I mourned …. then I missed it now i'm free I view AA,s now the same way I'd view Moonees ,,Davidions ,,Mormons ,, Muslims ,, Christians etc … all entitled to a belief but a cult all the same … observing altruist philosophies designed to fleece money by way of guilt …

    People in cults usually never know they were in a cult till after they leave ….. kinda like the matrix .. take the blue pill Tony things aren't bad out here the reason why people post the mugshots is that AA is a dangerous place its full of deviants and predators many whom are violent I for one have had several lady friends abused sexually … have seen three cases of pedophilia and My sponsor was murdered in 1993-4 by another member over a woman … so that being said …

    you see a person go to a meeting they get in a car with a sociopath with a history they are new should I say something ? or would that be mean?

    AA is a sham the steps are horse hockey Bill Wilson was a liar thief and a sexual predator he also was guilty of academic fraud in plagerizing "As Man Listens by Cecil Rose" he cut out 31 other people when he copyrighted the Big Book under HIS name …he left 10 percent of his fortune to his mistress … thats the truth I know it shocked me too once I started more was revealed and I saw … AA for what it really is … a Ten Billion dollar a year scam

  • This comment from last year was particularly shocking:

    suzie says

    I got sent to AA by the courts for a drunk in public charge I got while leaving a friends wedding reception. I met a guy at the meeting who I dated, I got a venereal disease from him and then found out they call him “Newcomer-Fucker”. Now I can’t get my court card completed because I am afraid to go back. Someone told me that they gave me the nickname “Beef-Curtains” because I have large labia and am a bit heavy. How utterly humiliating, AA sucks, I will never go back.
    September 14, 2009, 4:35 am

  • If you look at sites run by ex-Jehovah's Witnesses or ex-Scientologists, you will see the same issues there.

  • Tony J

    It’s funny that the regulars are feigning shock at McGowdog’s blog.

    Here’s a summary of this thread :

    “Carolee Bildsten is an AA in Illinois who pulled the “dine and dash” routine at a Joe’s Crab Shack. I supposed she figured that since she has given crabs to so many others, it is about time for someone to reciprocate.”

    And commenters went on to to make several vibrator jokes.

    Then one of the moderators wrote this :

    ” She’s in her van masturbating with a toy when the cops show up and find a loaded gun in the vehicle, so they arrest her.”

    I think when one enjoys posting on a filthy blog with filthy people, one shouldn’t be too quick to call attention to filth.

    Is the anti-AA motto ‘ignore the plank in your own eye, the speck in your neighbors is much more interesting’ ?

    SPJ :

    ” So, is the intent to not be taken seriously and show AA’s as sexist, bigoted, put down artists? If so, that’s not very fair to the vast majority of AA’s who are not like that at all. Deluded, yes. Sexist, bigoted and just plain mean, no.”

    I’m sorry. I didn’t know anything about this site was to be taken seriously.

    I like the way you call the vast majority of AA’s deluded and then cry that I was mean to you.

    You should definitely stay here. These are your people. Maybe one day you’ll have a break down and they’ll post your picture on their blog for public consumption too.

    Would that be nice or would that be mean ?

  • Tony J –

    Look you condone sites that puts kiddie porn up on the web. You even admit on your own website:

    “Warning, the above blog is by adults and for adults. It rated R and probably on the Howard Stern level of propriety. If this doesn’t offend you and if you want to hear some honest answers to the rhetoric and petty gossip being spewed on ant-AA sites please stop by.”

    Your site and the kiddie porn AA site (the girl naked in front of the drugs is definitely not 18) you are trying to promote have a total of 15 members. Neither site has an Alexis Score which means you are outcasts on the web.

    I think you need a meeting. Just go to the nearest dark, dank, church basement, I’m sure a meeting is being held their.

    Isn’t dark and dank places where trolls go? I realize that I am feeding the troll. Hopefully no one else will. I won’t even ask how many new comers to AA you have pushed to kill themselves so that they can become a statistic for your cult that you can talk about in one of your “Drunkalogs”.

  • hulahoop

    @anna – You know what the great thing about the interwebs is?

    I can make it just like AA if I want to; no cross talk!

    I just post what’s on my mind, read the stuff that interests me and leave the rest. It’s so neat!

    I know! It’s absolutely wonderful! And the best thing is I am not trapped in a room feeling obligated to nod my head and act interested while some jerk blathers on with a drunkalogue I’ve heard over and over again and an ending I’ve heard over and over again.

    I don’t know what happened to this lady. I don’t know her story. I do know her attorney is using AA to get some leniency for her. It’s a trick of the legal system. A defense attorney will recommend their client goes to AA before court so it will look like the accused is trying to get help for their problem. The accused is sent to place where she might receive some help. Or she might become brainwashed. Or she might end up getting victimized. It’s a big roll of the dice. The court is satisfied because the accused sought out free help. The defense attorney is satisfied because his client got a lighter sentence just like they do almost every time.

  • Ben Franklin

    Personally if I wanted to be insulted by steppers, I would go to a meeting.People who are still in intellectual and spiritual kindergardens have nothing to offer. Debating with steppers is fun at first, but quickly becomes boring and tiresome.

  • Ben Franklin

    This is analogous to how I feel about this right now:

    WARNING STEPPERS! BIG WORDS!

    http://secularoutpost.infidels.org/2010/09/goodby

    WARNING STEPPERS! This does not mean I am gay, Jewish or an Atheist. This does not mean I am amoral and should be killed. This does not mean I molest children. This does not mean I am sensitive or of weak mind. This does not mean you should assume anything. This does mean you have to look up the definition of "analogous".

  • Martha

    Judge Walker also pointed out that marriage has already changed before the current drive for marriage equality. He mentioned that interracial marriage was outlawed by some states up until 1967. Also he noted that traditional gender roles no longer apply and that marriage between a man and a woman is now a union of equals as shown by the dropping of the word "obey" from marriage vows. In the bad old days women were expected to be subservient to their husbands merely because the Bible said so. More encouraging signs that we are evolving away from patriarchal norms.

  • Tony J – said

    "You seem like such a reasonable young lady. They’ll have no choice but to take you seriously. "

    Why do you think I am a woman? Was that a sexist slur originating from the Oxford Group mentality that the Big Book was written on? Men have the same right to object when someone posts a nude picture of what looks like a 14 year old in front of cocaine and a large stack of money as women do. I did notice that that picture was taken down early this morning after I mentioned it, and replaced with a bunch of barely 18 year olds in bathing suits. Well AA is a is based on attraction rather than promotion. By looking at the pictures being posted I can see what that site is trying to attract. Just be careful that the soft porn pictures being posted do not promote anything else. Especially to a vulnerable new comer. Or are you trying to subliminally make people think they will find these young babes in the rooms when they go? For your promotion model are you using "Sex Sells" to attract people to the site? Do you really think that is a wise way to get people to keep coming back?

    By the way I am a male.

  • tintop

    Ben, you are quite right. It is futile to argue with a stepper. It is boring and futile. They are far too stupid. especially, "tony"; whose menatl acuity is at the vanishing point.

  • Martha

    It is not always futile to debate steppers assuming they are not the drive by ranters we sometimes get. At anytime there might be people lurking here who are considering AA or just starting in AA. Some of those may read something here that resonates with their preexisting doubts. If I had read this or Orange earlier it might encouraged me to leave AA sooner.

  • I'm just surprised that I got them to pull down the naked 14 year old looking girl picture from the website. Looking back at his posts Tony J does have a sexist opinion of women. It is obvious he does not respect women and I am sure that none of his AA buddies do either. You know the old saying "birds of a feather flock together". I mean come on they have a picture of a woman sitting on a mans face and claim it is one of the people from this site and the caption

    "Looks like I picked a bad year to quit fighting Anti-AA."

    What are they trying to say? That if you quit fighting AA you get laid? What scares me the most is that these people run meetings and have influence over them. I mean the owner of the site is bragging how it is his birthday and is going to go home after work and do his wife. Civilized people do not talk that way. I am afraid for my nieces who are about the same ages as the ones posted on that site, will be approached by one of these two. It is obvious what they want and they have learned mind control to get it.

  • Ben Franklin

    @ Martha, we get enough drive by's that having an in-resident AA stooge-guru is pointless. The Dombeck blog is proof of that. People will get turned off here by the vitriol and accuse us of being angry all the time.

  • Ben Franklin

    From the blog I posted:

    NOT, let me emphasize, because I was intimidated by the cogency of the arguments. On the contrary, I found the arguments so execrably awful and pointless that they bored and disgusted me

  • We have a debate forum on the community pages…

  • Martha

    @Ben Franklin. I agree we should distinguish between drive by's and those whose goal is disrupting our work. I wonder if there is consensus to free this blog of the disruptors?.

  • Tony J

    JR

    “Look you condone sites that puts kiddie porn up on the web. You even admit on your own website:”

    Really ? You’d better call the prope authorities then.

    And when you’re done, you’d better call the proper authorities and tell them about the deadly AA cult.

    If not, you’ll be just as guilty since you have this damning information and people are dying as we speak.

    You seem like such a reasonable young lady. They’ll have no choice but to take you seriously.

    If no one believes you just send them here. This site wants judges to come one so they can teach them. Maybe you can be one of the chief advocates.

  • eddy

    If I had read the Orange Papers first I would never have gone the place.

  • Tony J

    Johny Crash
    “People in cults usually never know they were in a cult till after they leave ….. ”

    Well, after reading your talking points learned by rote directly from you Master Orange, I’m wondering if you won’t know you’re in the anti-AA cult until you leave.

    It’s funny, I’ve never heard so many people piss and moan about ‘being free’ when they clearly haven’t had an original thought in years.

    Maybe the sicker of the AA’s gravitate towards this anti-AA movement. We don’t seem to have the problems in my AA meetings that you guys do. Mabye that’s becuase you guys are the problem…….? It’s a thought.

  • causeandeffect

    Considering the source, I take all of Tony J’s insults to be compliments.

  • DeConstructor

    @Mr. Tony Johnson

    “It’s funny, I’ve never heard so many people piss and moan about ‘being free’ when they clearly haven’t had an original thought in years.”

    Here is the AA system of encouraging “original thought”, an automatic answer for every query.

    http://webpages.charter.net/jlbond/slogans.htm

  • Martha

    It is really annoying that some steppers say we are atheists as if that was an insult. In their mindset that denies that AA is religious yet justifies saying The Lord’s Prayer at meetings. One stepper justified the practice by claiming the U.S. is a “Christian Nation.” No it is not. We live in a secular nation where all religions are equal and no religion is allowed to dictate the rules to people not members of their religion. One of my new heroes is Judge Vaughn Walker for his striking down Prop 8. He made the point merely because a religion has a narrow definition of marriage there is no reason for the state to define marriage in a manner that satisfies that religion.

    http://www.infidels.org/library/modern/farrell_till/myth.html

  • DeConstructor

    @Martha

    Judge Vaughn Walker did his duty. People do not understand how LDS Inc encouraged/commanded members to take second mortgages out on their homes to “donate” to the fight against prop 8, while the very wealthy LDS Inc still enjoys a religious tax free status. This has happened before, the last time in 1978, when President Jimmy Carter threatened to take away their tax exempt status as they would not allow African Americans to have leadership positions.

    An immediate “revelation” happened that changed that policy.

    By overturning prop 8, Judge Walker did send a message to the zealots that the US constitution trumps every time. These rulings will someday have an effect on our work here, as atheists get more recognition, and forcing religious activity to combat an alleged medical “disease” becomes exposed as a exercise of futility.

  • tintop

    jr harris:

    you are wasing your time, you are talking to an idiot. Tony has not had an independent thought in years. If that username has ever had one.

  • Mike

    @jr, I’m the object of the face sitting pic, I continually bring up the subject of sexual predators in the program so I guess they are trying to say I have issues myself or something. Anyway I kind of see it as humorous, but can also understand how others find it offensive.

  • causeandeffect

    JR Harris, good job getting them to remove what appeared to be underaged smut they were peddling. Hmmm, makes me think the girl you described really was underaged. Apparently now they have changed to smut of legal age? To sell AA? And this disrespect for young women demonstrates their high morals? And they object to jokes about batteries? And they expect anyone to take them seriously? Please.

    I can only hope that Carolee will have a strong sense of humor when she goes to AA and can make all the jokes about herself before others do. A sense of humor would be the only defense she would have in her situation. If she does, she'll have the best drunkolog in the room.

  • @causeandeffect Well that site still has a long way to go. They still have a picture of a boy about 12 years old with a bloody nose and lip on the site. I suppose they are trying to say he had a nose bleed because of doing drugs, but it does not say it, instead they go on a rant about this site. The kid could have just been beat up. It really bothers me when they use underage kids on their site. I have to wonder where their minds are at. If they are going to be putting stuff like that up, they should not be using kids.

  • Rick045

    Here’s an update on this one, Carolee Bildsten attempts to explain her side of the story.

    http://triblocal.com/gurnee/2011/01/25/woman-accused-of-cop-assault-with-sex-toy-says-she-acted-in-self-defense/

  • SoberPJ

    Interesting read… so much drama….. for those here that have left AA, have you noticed a clear and significant drop in your life-drama quotient? The AA world seems full of constant drama which kind of runs antithetical to the serenity achievement mantra. I mean, how do you really achieve serenity when you are immersed in such a drama-filled environment? Judging by the steppers who post here, I guess you don’t.

  • humanspirit

    @Rick045

    A “clear, rigid feminine pleasure device” ! Should we add this to the AADictionary?

    “The officer was not injured,” Seems like his higher power was working overtime, protecting him from injury from feminine pleasure devices, clear and rigid or otherwise.

    I’m glad to see the US police force are as ever keeping y’all safe in your beds at night 🙂 . We haven’t had this particular threat in the UK as far as I know, but obviously all of us in the western world have to keep up the utmost vigilance from these forces in our midst. that would destroy our way of life.

    (Sorry for the flippancy everyone. This is the funniest thing I’ve seen since the You Exhaust Me guy!)

  • Rick045

    @HS, lol, that might be a candidate for the AADictionary. I thought the photo taken in front of Joe’s Crab Shack was a nice touch. To SoberPJ’s point about the drama though, stuff like this really is what keeps a lot of people “coming back”.

  • Gunthar2000

    @Rick045…

    Jesus I’m happy that you posted that!
    I think that Carolee’s side of the story totally makes sense.
    She even looks kind of cute standing there in front of the Crab Shack.
    Mug shots always show us at our worst… It’s good to see Carolee in such good space.

  • AnnaZed

    Well, it was nice of the local paper to give Ms. Bildsten a forum for defending herself though frankly that entire thing reads like some pretty classic habitually drunk person self-justifying bull-shit, but never mind that. I do think that Ms. Bildsten should consider looking into some other approaches to dealing with her alcohol problem. I will say that.

  • Rick045

    I agree Gunthar, it’s a bizarre story and easy to laugh at, but I do hope things work out well for her.

  • AnnaZed

    I did notice that in her account of the events Ms. Bildsten is quoted depicting herself as “hungry and lonely” so she is obviously well indoctrinated. This is not her first time at the rodeo boys. She need only have added “angry and tired” to meet the H.A.L.T. criteria, which as every AA knows are an immediate pass for any ensuing drunken behaviour. Relapse being a part of recovery and all.

    So lets see, she walks over to the Crab Shack from her nearby “hotel room” residence while feeling at 50% H.A.L.T. Pity that she didn’t call another AA member for help, but there you have it. There she has wine and food and gets shit-faced. It is only then that she realizes that she has forgotten her credit card. Hummm, ok. Yet at the time of the altercation she is searching her sock drawer for cash. Yup, rigorously honest™ and entirely credible.

  • hulahoop

    I do feel sorry for this lady. I was reading about the great Taco Bell meat mystery today. I found a link to her on AOL. She is now the poster child for what not to do with your vibrator.