Who Knew?!

Alcoholics Anonymous As A Spiritual Experience

That poor woman in the picture looks like she’s sick and tired of being sick and tired!

Has anyone heard about this Alcoholics Anonymous thing?

26 Responses to 'Who Knew?!'

  1. I guess I should have commented on the studies that they cite in this CNN article, but it would have seriously put a cramp on my snark.

    So, there's this: http://www.eurekalert.org/pub_releases/2010-12/ac

    The researchers recruited 223 hazardously-drinking women (averaged around 12 drinks per drinking day) from the women's facility at the Rhode Island Department of Corrections Adult Correctional Institute and ran two sessions – one during incarceration and one after release – along with a one-, three- and six-month follow-up to determine alcohol and treatment use. During the sessions, a timeline method was used to assess the alcohol use of the participants in the previous 90 days, as well as determining the severity of their involvement with alcohol, exposure to other drugs and participation in AA.

    The data showed that if the women attended AA once a week or more, there was a significant decrease in the levels of alcohol-related consequences, and an overall decrease in the total days spent drinking.

    *sigh* Comapred to what?

    And this one: http://health.usnews.com/health-news/family-healt

    The new study included more than 1,500 adult alcoholics who were followed through their recovery process for 15 months. The researchers found a strong association between more frequent attendance of AA meetings, increased spirituality and decreased frequency and intensity of alcohol use.

    Right. Because spirituality is a thing that can be quantified. Will I be raising the dead in the marketplace if I go to AA 3 times a day?

  2. Gunthar2000 says:

    I went into the comments and I'm going to bust an artery if I read any more.

    You'd better bring some ammo if yer steppin into that trench. I'll wait until tomorrow when I calm down, then I'll drop a hit and run grenade on 'em.

  3. Mona Lisa says:

    That damn fool Humphreys is at it again. Anytime there's some crap research like this getting publicity, you know he's involved.

  4. causeandeffect says:

    I posted twice, but it's not showing up. Ya think maybe they bounced because I used a fictional email address?

  5. DeConstructor says:

    I posted twice- one showed up one did not. This might be a more effective link for us to contact…

    http://www.cnn.com/feedback/forms/form5.html?67

  6. AndyM says:

    "Someone will say something profound that everyone can connect with beyond themselves, and it can be very moving," said Humphreys, who was not involved in the study but also researches the effects of Alcoholics Anonymous. "That is a spiritual process."

    I must have been to a couple of thousand meetings but I've never heard anybody say anything profound. Maybe they were the wrong meetings?

  7. AnnaZed says:

    @AndyM, in literally over 3,000 meetings I never once heard a single "profound" observation, never.

  8. truebeliever says:

    Good outreach over ther AZ!

    I posted a few myself.

  9. tintop says:

    I never heard a profound observation either.

  10. causeandeffect says:

    I've never heard a profound observation either. I have even been to numerous meetings where there is a high concentration of old timers. They read a paragraph from the 12&12 then comment. They don't really speak in slogans so much, but they are still saying absolutely nothing. It really amazes me how they speak and manage to say nothing at all!!! It's like a real talent. Another is a speaker meeting where they are testifying how AA has changed their lives, but actually they are exposing how truly inept they are in dealing with even the smallest difficulties in life, yet everyone thinks it's just wonderful! Really boggles my mind!!! So Andy, it doesn't seem to be the particular meeting. I have gone to many different ones and have found nothing of value.

  11. William Casey says:

    I've heard quite a few comments in AA meetings which were meaningful to me and inspired reflection. I wouldn't go so far as to label them "profound" (life changing) in the philosophical sense.

  12. hulahoop says:

    I’ve heard quite a few comments in AA meetings which were meaningful to me and inspired reflection. I wouldn’t go so far as to label them “profound” (life changing) in the philosophical sense.

    @William Casey

    Well said. It was the same for me. I like hearing different points of view. It gave me food for thought. I met a lot of people I truly enjoyed meeting.

    AA reminds me a lot of church. Sometimes the preacher gives a sermon you can really relate with or gives a different take on what you believe. Some of the people are there for the right reasons and some of the people are there for the wrong reasons. It's too bad some of the people ruin it for others. Or maybe that some of the people allow others to ruin it for them.

  13. Mike says:

    I never heard much profound stuff, but I did hear a lot of clever quips. I like this one regarding volunteering at the group level: "20% of the people do 80% of the work".

    There's dozens more like it.

  14. violet says:

    just had a friend email this article. fuck it all. seriously. and fuck baby jesus, too.

  15. violet says:

    soo happy to see mr. casey is back (sarcasm is in the tone here.)

  16. humanspirit says:

    @Mike

    The "80/20 rule" isn't necessarily an AA thing and is very common in business-speak. I don't know about its merits, but it seems to me just like another one of these things that AA people have appropriated to serve their own agenda,

  17. humanspirit says:

    @violet

    I am actually quite pleased to see William Casey back (without sarcasm). It's healthy to have an opposing point of view, however much we might disagree with it. So as far as I'm concerned, welcome back, WC. (Same goes for Anonymous Of Course too.)

  18. hulahoop says:

    It’s healthy to have an opposing point of view, however much we might disagree with it.

    @humanspirit – The world would be a boring place without it.

  19. humanspirit says:

    @ ftg "The researchers found a strong association between more frequent attendance of AA meetings, increased spirituality and decreased frequency and intensity of alcohol use."

    Ftg, What you say. What the fuck has 'spirituality' got to do with not drinking? There are so many completely different and wholly unconnected ideas going on here. And, as you say, what does 'increased spirituality' actually mean? AA seems to have set the whole agenda, in that they have managed to conflate the very human problem of addiction to a chemical substance with some kind of belief in the supernatural. How on earth did they manage to achieve this, and how did this nonsensical idea ever get such widespread credence?

  20. Gunthar2000 says:

    Whoops! Looks like they mistakenly used a bullshitometer instead of a spiritualometer!

  21. AnnaZed says:

    @Gunthar2000: "…Whoops! Looks like they mistakenly used a bullshitometer instead of a spiritualometer!"

    Looks like this study was compiled using a Scientology E-meter or some such super scientific measuring device. What on earth even IS "increased spirituality"? It's bullshit, that's what it is.

  22. eddy says:

    Hey I thought Humphries and Mclellan were tossed from the White House.

  23. eddy says:

    Not according to Miller:
    http://www.time.com/time/health/article/0,8599,18

    The spirtual group was suffering more severe depression and anxiety than the secular group. In otherwords who needs the hassle of a 12 step program. wow grueling and punishing.

    oh by the way the mclellan and humphreys exit:
    http://www.tnr.com/article/politics/rehab

  24. raysny says:

    In the comments section, "AA member 32 years Bill S. Minnetonka" writes:

    "The concept of Higher Power for me, extends beyond religion or God. Anytime I am willing to listen (and hopefully learn) from another human being (in or out of AA) is believing in a power grater than myself. I believe that my HP guides me through interaction with others."

    I would love to sit down with that man and discuss religion. What the hell is he talking about? Maybe this is one of those profound things heard in AA.

    Coincidentally, I played "profound" for 70 points yesterday in Lexulous.

  25. raysny says:

    I posted:

    You all need Religion 101.

    You might be able to make a case for non-denominational, never non-religious. You confuse spiritual with religious and religious with organized religion. A "Higher Power" is a god. If you pray to something, you're making it a god. Atheists do not have "Higher Powers", they do not pray nor do they expect prayers to be answered.

    The AA group as a higher power is a bait & switch. Wilson explains it:

    “We found that as soon as we were able to lay aside prejudice and express even a willingness to believe in a Power greater than ourselves, we commenced to get results, even though it was impossible for any of us to fully define or comprehend that Power, which is God.” (BB, pg 46)

    "You can, if you wish, make AA itself your 'higher power.' Here's a

    very large group of people who have solved their alcohol problem. In

    this respect they are certainly a power greater than you, who have not

    even come close to a solution. Surely you can have faith in them. Even

    this minimum of faith will be enough. You will find many members who

    have crossed the threshold just this way. All of them will tell you

    that, once across, their faith broadened and deepened. Relieved of the

    alcohol obsession, their lives unaccountably transformed, they came to

    believe in a Higher Power, and most of them began to talk of God."

    (Twelve and Twelve, Step Two, pg. 29)

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